Inliners International Forums General Discussion Blown and Injected snowman4839 turbo build

Another turbo that is about right size. The only thing bad is it is a t3, but it would still do the job.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/t3-t4-t04...=item2a1142c696

Well would it work somewhat well until I can get the headwork and forged rods and pistons? What type of drawbacks would it have? I'm only shooting for 4-6psi on this low boost setup.

Snowman,

That 70 size compressor turbo is too big for your stock engine & will not spool fast & will be inefficient for the low boost level you are only going to run.

In other words, it will run very poorly, do not buy it.

I just posted it because it was cheap & a faily large turbo.

This turbo would work perfect for your combo,. 63 A/R on the turbine housing for quick spool anything bigger will not get into boost that fast for your stock engine.
I just cannot seem to find those specs on a low dollar Ebay turbo.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Turboneti...=item25647de5d7

I would not recommend a turbo too big for your engine right now.
I only am giving my own personal experience w/turbos on a 4.3 liter engine 262 CI a littler bigger, so I know first hand that anything bigger than a .63 A/R will need @ least 2400 RPM stall to be able to boost launch & get into boost fast.

You are going to run a manual trans so the load on your engine will differ than an auto trans.

I would not want you to get a turbo that will boost up really slow, not be fun to drive, & in general an overall dog of a car to drive..

I would like you to succeed & have a daily driver that can run 13's in the 1/4 & faster w/your better purpose built combo later on down the road.

My Syclone used to run 14's when I first got it.
I have done some R&D & thinking outside the box on parts to add/bolt-on to my Syclone & runs 12.0 to this date.

I chose a different route than the norm & mainly a low dollar high labor program to get my Syclone to run decent.

The wide band tool got me closer to a decent tune in a short amount of time & is one of the best tools to tune with, that & monitoring engine knock/pinging. http://jandssafeguard.com/


MBHD

Haha I'd like to see 13 seconds too!

Well considering the fact that we've tossed several turbos back and forth and none were the right one, can you guys give me a list (Compressors, Turbines, A/Rs, trims, etc.) to search for or find one for me that's in my price range (like up to $400) please?

EDIT: I've done quite a bit of looking and I can't find anything smaller with a t4 flange than .68AR turbine and .70 compressor. Everything else is a T3 hybrid

Here's maybe a solution? I found a turbo that's a T4/GT35 turbo and it has the compressor inlet 1" smaller than the all T4 turbo but it has the same A/Rs (.68 Tur, .70 Comp). Would that help enough to negate the undesirable A/Rs?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/GODSPEED-...#ht_3573wt_1042

I thin a 70 on the compressor is just going to be too big. Here is another but would rather like to see a .81 or so exh.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SUPER-T4-...sQ5fAccessories

http://www.treadstoneperformance.com/prod_imgs/installation/ul/install-1.pdf
If you will notice in the Turbonetics matrix chart, they only recommend a .81 A/R for the turbine housing. A "Q" trim turbine wheel, But look what HP they are saying what the .81 A/R is used for 1000 HP! A .96 A/R is good for 1200 HP.

I do not think Snowman is looking for a turbine housing of .81 or .96 right now that is good for 1000-1200 HP,just me thinking out loud.

The turbo he posted http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/GODSPEED-...#ht_3573wt_1042

Compressor Wheel diameter: inducer 56.59, not too big.
The compressor A/R is .70, that is not the inducer size of the compressor wheel.

Tlowe,
Your your turbo : http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SUPER-T4-...sQ5fAccessories
Has the turbine spec you recommend for a stock 250 is .96 = perfect, correct? 54 MM inducer compressor wheel.


MBHD

Saw the 70 A/R for the compressor. Sorry for that.
I am done here.
Here is a post put up by me a while ago. Goodluck.
https://www.inliners.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=39568#Post39568

Snowman,

A T3 turbo will work absolutly perfect for you. There is nothing wrong using a T3 turbocharger.
A T4 turbocharger will work absolutly fine also.

You just need to look for a T3/T4 Hybrid that has a turbine wheel of approx 57-64 MM exducer wheel roughly 2.3-2.5" range will work for now.
The compressor wheel of 54-57 MM will work fine.

MBHD

Well guys so far I've got a turbo (GT35 T4 turbo), AEM UEGO wideband, and spectre carb hat. I've been thinking and since I have so much extra money, you guys think it'd be worth it to just buy a turbo carb and try to sell my holley 390? Or should I just go ahead and follow a blowthrough carb conversion like this?

I just looked at the prices and the sizes of the pre-made blow-through carbs and never mind. They're extremely expensive and only come in like 600cfm+ sizes.

I'm also wondering, will the vacuum secondaries work correctly since they'll be in a positive pressure when boosted? Also will this affect the power-valve?

I am thinking to use a vacuum carb it will work, but I believe a D.P. will work better.

http://www.theturboforums.com/smf/index.php?topic=51153.0


MBHD

What is a D.P.?

Double Pumper

Correct.
Probably easier to tune a 500 CFM 2bbl Holley for blow through application.
Like Shads.

MBHD

Well if I sold my 390 and went bought a holley 500 2bbl, would having to use an adapter plate restrict anything? Also do 2 barrel have half of a four barrel (a primary and a secondary) or is it like a dual single barrel (two primaries)?

the 500 is just like half a 4b Just two butterfly opening at the same time.

Snowman,

Take a good look at my picture album. This is a Holley 2300 2bbl 350 cfm carb. I tried to document my Hanger18 mod. The 500 cfm model is the exact same, just flows 150 more cfm. You might look at a 350 cfm model, I think it will be easier to tune than the 500. Both would work. I do believe that you can get a Holley 2300 2bbl for much cheaper than a 390cfm 4bbl. I would sell it and find a 500 or 350 cfm 2bbl. Just my .02c.

https://picasaweb.google.com/shadmeier/JEDTurboHuffer

Boucher

A 500 Holley 2bbl does not flow 500 cfm, it is closer to 350 cfm. It will also support about 350 hp with just 5 psi as done on my 250.
I would suggest a 390 double pumper or a a 600 as there is little to choose from inbetween. Tom

holley used to make an economy replacement spreadbore carb to use in place of a q-jet, numbered 4360 "economaster" I think, (not to be confused with the 4165 "spreadbores"). it is a 450 cfm carb (four bbl talk)with mech. secondaries. 1-3/8 primary. 1- 7/16 secondary bores. They were not popular as they didnt get too much better economy than a stock q-jet ( same sized primary barrels) and nowhere the hp (DUH dropping down from a 750 cfm carb to a 450 cfm carb-what do you expect). But its a dandy size for a 250 six and more compact than a 390 cfm holley design. Had one on my '67 std shift p.u. with headers-it was a replacement for a 350 chevy q-jet. They do make one to replace the q-jet on a buick 238 V6- that one has some extra idle circuit work on the secondaries. Thats the one to get. I got some holley literature about it and duplicated these v6 mods to my v8 model and it turned out to be a good streetable carb on my "cold" clifford intake. its milage didnt break the bank either. I have seen some on e-bay. These are a good, yet unknown carbs for 230 to 305 inch motors. Ran that setup for 2-3 years before I tried a common 1850 (list number) 600 cfm vacuum secondary. It was ok and smooth because of the vacuum- but the 4360 was the real sleeper. Not many at swap meets anymore, they came out in the mid-seventies. These shoehorn right in between the 390 and 600 sizes.

Sounds like a possible carb for Snowman to find.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/450-CFM-M...sQ5fAccessories

450 carb DP ? http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Holley-Ca...sQ5fAccessories

MBHD

Hank
that second link on the 450 is not a DP it is just a Mech. secondray carb with a transfur tube like any Vac secondary 600 holley. That is the same 450/s I run.And to used this carb with a turbo hat You need to change the bowls on it and do away with the transfur tube and put Dual feed bowls on it.And you use The metering block off a 390 carb for the rear.I have talked with Holley on this matter,That is how I know you can use the 390 metering block.

Ok, good to know.

MBHD

Well guys, I'm probably going to buy a Holley 500cfm 2bbl. It'll probably be easier for me to tune too.

Is there a certain size or brand of BOV or wastegate I need? ebay suggestions?

http://cgi.ebay.com/TURBOSMART-ULTRA-GAT...=item231128acd3

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NIB-TURBO...sQ5fAccessories


MBHD

Alrighty then. Do you guys have any suggestions on fuel pressure regulator and fuel pump? Or could you tell me what I need?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HLY-12-803/

for low boost http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CRT-M4503/

Did you get a carb?


MBHD

I worked with Ak Miller in the 70s and 80s. I did a few turbos on Chevy and Ford inlines and he liked the Ford Autolite two barrel carbs. They are easy to tune and are CHEAP. They use the Holley two barrel mounting flange and have annular boosters which help. they are easy to blow through.
I commonly used the stock fuel pump and just drilled a hole (carefully) in the pump over the diaphram and ran a boost line from the intake to the top of the pump. The boost automatically raised the fuel pressure to the carb exactly the correct amount. I ran up to 15psi like this with no problems.
My 70 Nove with a 4 speed ran 7.9's in the eighth on a hot day off the street.

@MBHD I still have that bid on that holley 500cfm 2bbl which I'm pretty sure I'll win.

Are you sure that that that fuel pump will work? Do you have any suggestions that will work on the high boost setup? I'd like to be able to buy the fuel pump and regulator and not have to worry about it ever again.

@Hodrodrobert I'll look into those autolites if I don't win the 500cfm holley 2bbl auction. So you just ran a pressurized air line into the top of the fuel pump? Wouldn't this just circulate air through your fuel line? Did that negate the need for the fuel pressure regulator?

What type of engine did your nova have?

So by 6psi being "ok", you aren't expecting much? I've been waiting for my first big break in performance and nothing has made much a difference (but I haven't done much either). Is the boosted stock setup going to be much different than the stock setup?

Also, should I invest the time to put the lump ports and valvetrain in now? Or should I just go ahead and throw on the turbo stuff and not worry about that stuff until I get the forged rods and pistons?

Well wouldn't it be cheaper to go a machine shop and ask them to do all of that for me then install the lumps and stuff myself?

Also, what type of HP/TQ do you guys think a blowthough 500cfm holley 2bbl will make using the off and 2.5" 3-stud log manifold @ 6psi on the stock longblock?

EDIT: I also got outbid on that ebay 500cfm holley 2bbl. What price range do those things usually go for?

EDIT 2: Also, when I weld the pipe to the mounting flange for the turbo, should I try to fab the pipe into the square shape for better flow or should I just weld the pipe straight on and using thick sheet metal to cover what's left open? the 2.5" pipe almost dirrectly fits from top to bottom and it leaves some space on the sides which I could cut and weld pieces into.

Installing lumps is not the expensive part, it's all the other work involved.
Companies sells adaptor pipes for a T4 flange to 2.5" pipe.

http://www.mandrel-bends.com/catalog/tra...o-form-665.html

http://www.bufkinengineering.com/turbo_bracket.htm

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4690582-Turbo-Support-Bracket-Brace


MBHD

There is a lot of machine work done to make one of these heads flow/ perform.
500 Holleys go from 50-150 all the time. Bought one this spring at a swapmeet for 20.00.
With the stock cam/ head expect to go from around 140-145 hp w/ 220 tq on your worn engine to 200 hp and 275-280 tq.
Do a cam and head work, then you will build much more tq.

Take your time and fab up a strong downpipe. While you are at it make a stand that bolts to engine mount to help support the weight of turbo.

Well damn. I already bought a t4 flange and I expected to have to make the t4 to 2.5". W/e, I guess I will anyway.

Do I still need that fuel pressure regulator if I do that drill and tap on the fuel pump and run the boost line to it?

You wont need a F.P. reg w/a mechanical stock type pump.

MBHD

Do you guys think it would be smarter to buy a 2 barrel plate for the offy manifold or cut the 4 barrel one I have into a hole and then bolt a 4-to-2 barrel and just bolt that ontop of the cut out plate. If I used the adapter plate, it also don't think I would need a spacer plate so that the throttle linkage doesn't hit. What do you guys think?

Maybe this guy has a adaptor for you?

http://www.t6racing.org/id3.html

MBHD